I think they were specifically referring to the pregnant tulpa thing, rather than symbolism as a whole
5:08 PM
I guess it would be in the sense that the symbolism of a pregnant tulpa wouldn't do much to help any aspect of making a new tulpa? It could do well for the belief that they exist?(edited)
You can't impreggo a tulpa unless if you want to actually cause that, which makes symbolism. They can't give birth to a new tulpa unless if you actually force the tulpa, or else it's essentially an instatulpa. It's just weird overall.
I wonder if there is a distinction between symbolism that is backed by some concept and symbolism that isn't. Like, if the person's tulpa pregnancy was a symbol of them forcing a new tulpa vs them just imagining their tulpa was pregnant
Anyways, there's nothing inherently wrong with pregnant tulpas, but there's certainly a negative association with them. Every system I've met that has messed around with tulpa pregnancy has been so far off the escapist deep end that there's no hope of ever convincing them to think critically about the nature of the tulpa phenomenon.
5:18 PM
Like, sure, go ahead and make a pregnant tulpa, but don't talk to me about what tulpas are or aren't without thinking about it for awhile with some rigor.
At best they are into doing their own thing, which is fine, but I feel like you should forfeit your right to hold an authoritative conversational position if you aren't interested in understanding the phenomenon.
That'll never happen, though, and I guess that's good. There's probably some better way of dealing with the problem of "non-rigorous hosts being the mouths from which newbs learn about shit."
5:21 PM
Lol, it's not good to attack a practice based solely on what the people who do it are like, yeah.
Good ideas will spread when spoken freely. I would be careful about trying to say who should and shouldn't be listened to. I've often been frustrated with similar. However, I think this sort of fantasy and exaggeration, is healthy for the community to exist and he heard in tandem with more grounded and serious opinions.
Where do you get the idea that experimentation needs a strong justification so long as the experimentation itself is not hurting anyone? If the symbolism fails, one can just abandon it and force the new tulpa normally.
Namely, because those who try to live in fantasy are probably trying to escape a situation they truly cannot change, and to help them in that time is good.
In terms of arguing for fucking around with tulpa pregnancy, in the context of the community, I don't see it ever doing anything but acting as another strange siren song for the escapists and the willfully ignorant.
Experimentation is good. The mind is a complex and amazing thing and one should try to get the most out of what it can do. One should look for new ways of doing something and should not avoid something simply because it is deemed unnecessary.
I will say that there are many actively trying to supress more serious or grounded forms of tulpamancy. It is those people I have a massive issue with, and who I believe are the source of your issues as well.
@Abvieon {Alex} if you want a crisp clean fresh claim, a rephrasing, let me try and put it this way:
5:31 PM
There is a huge issue with this community, a lack of rigorous thought about the tulpa phenomenon.
5:31 PM
I have personally identified the decline in rigorous thought within the community to have existed alongside the rise in erp/cutesytups/escapisthosts/etc.
5:32 PM
These distractions (from rigorously thinking about the tulpa phenomenon) are not inherently problematic.
5:32 PM
They are fine as acts.
5:32 PM
However, every tulpa community area (discord servers, irc, forums, etc) are always acting as the landing area for new people.
5:33 PM
These new people trend towards the erp/cutesytups/escapisthosts/etc. crowds more and more.
5:33 PM
Because it's fucking easy to not ask questions about tulpas and to assume that what you're doing makes sense.
I don't think a "lack of rigorous thought" is characterized by escapism or fantasy, but rather a refusal or avoidance to thinking in depth about things or the mechanics behind them. I don't think most people actively avoid doing so, though a lot of people just end up not because they aren't the type of person to be inclined towards that sort of thing, or it never really crosses their mind to do so in the first place. Someone can be an escapist or "degenerate" as you call them and still exercise rigorous thought. Hell, in some ways I'm an escapist and love delving into fantasy but I also enjoy thinking about things critically, coming up with theories, etc.
@Abvieon {Alex} Maybe you're interested in that sort of thing, but I've had too many experiences of being told 1) "how can you even have tulpas, you clearly hate them" 2) "I don't even care about what a tulpa is" 3) "how dare you try to invalidate my tulpas" etc. when I 1) love my tulpas more than most anyone or anything and 3) i'm not at all even invalidating tulpas. 2) this is legitimately anti-thought
5:38 PM
@Deleted User that's not what I'm proposing, but okay.
5:39 PM
Also, a refusal or avoidance to thinking in depth about the mechanics of the tulpa phenomenon should probably exclude people from answering questions about the mechanics of the tulpa phenomenon.
[mooh, there is more to life than rigorous thoughts. And that's what we are doing host and tulpa, living our lives. It doesn't even have to be a priority really. And don't say to just go find other places this is like the only place you can safely be open about it.]
Tulpas are for people. I think we should try not to judge their motivation. But yes, anti-science is a problem, you seem to mistakenly assume sources of it thoguh.
